Tropes and cliches

[banshee]

The stories here of course aren't free of these things, this isn't bad, in fact its completely normal.

Are there any tropes or cliches you would like to see less? Some you would like to see more?

[Gaggedcowgirl]

“I have you now my pretty/dear!”

I don’t know. Something about that is humiliating to me and I like it. You

[Detective-Gag]

There isn’t much I would like to see “less of”, per se.

Damsels-in-distress…OTM gags…tape gags…hostage scenarios…kidnappings…ransoms…all of that comes with the territory.

What I WOULD like to see are some over-the-top, supervillain scenarios…think those old Batman-animated situations where the damsel-in-distress was not just kidnapped; but ended up strapped to some kind of elaborate, convoluted peril where the savior had to jump through hoops to save them.

Ridiculous, yes.

Fun, though. XD

[banshee]

What I WOULD like to see are some over-the-top, supervillain scenarios…think those old Batman-animated situations where the damsel-in-distress was not just kidnapped; but ended up strapped to some kind of elaborate, convoluted peril where the savior had to jump through hoops to save them.

Ridiculous, yes.

Fun, though. XD

I can definitively get behind that

[captured_prize]

What I WOULD like to see are some over-the-top, supervillain scenarios…think those old Batman-animated situations where the damsel-in-distress was not just kidnapped; but ended up strapped to some kind of elaborate, convoluted peril where the savior had to jump through hoops to save them.

Ridiculous, yes.

Fun, though. XD

I can definitively get behind that

Same here. That's partly how I got into bondage.

[KidnappedCowboy]

There isn’t much I would like to see “less of”, per se.

Damsels-in-distress…OTM gags…tape gags…hostage scenarios…kidnappings…ransoms…all of that comes with the territory.

What I WOULD like to see are some over-the-top, supervillain scenarios…think those old Batman-animated situations where the damsel-in-distress was not just kidnapped; but ended up strapped to some kind of elaborate, convoluted peril where the savior had to jump through hoops to save them.

Ridiculous, yes.

Fun, though. XD

I write those...but the stories are about dudes in distress getting rescued by other dudes!

[Fandango]

Are there any tropes or cliches you would like to see less? Some you would like to see more?

I love this question, [mention]banshee[/mention]. This is something that I think about a lot. Apologies, I'm going to give a lengthy response.

I don't hate any tropes. I actually love the fact that there are tropes because when I notice one that irks me or rubs me the wrong way I collect it and will usually try and play with it in a story. I'm doing that with a couple right now. I also think that any trope that's used often enough is done so because people like it. And why would I get mad at something that other people enjoy. So I think that tropes are valuable. But I have some I'd like to see less, some I'd like to see more, and some that I'd like to see explored differently. Please realize that I absolutely understand that the vast majority of these stories are fantasies that require suspension of disbelief. But I like to overanalyze things sometimes and apply them to the real world. It's just what I do.

There are three that I can think of that I don't particularly care for or would like to see played with differently. Please know that a lot of the best authors on this site use these and I'm not knocking them. Some of them are very fun. I'll use these at some point. But they're just things that I think are too regular to not be examined and toyed with.

• A character ending a story in bondage wondering when they're going to be released or thinking to themselves that they have 5, 6, 7 hours left until somebody finds them. I think this strikes me as off-putting and sometimes a little lazy. It definitely works in some cases. But in others I think that it's used because the author didn't have a reasonable idea of how to end the story once the person got out. Some authors like to leave things to the reader's imagination. That's fine. But I like to know that a character got released. And I oftentimes want to see the fallout. To me a story isn't really over if somebody is still tied up at the end of it.

• Antagonists, bullies, rivals, and ne'er-do-wells who think that they can bind and humiliate somebody that they know and that there won't be consequences for them. This is a common theme and it's present in many of my FAVORITE stories. I love a confident villain. I've stated as much to several authors. But...there are certain things that I want to know that the villain has considered. I'm not talking about masked burglars who think that they CAN get away with their actions. I'm talking about rival co-workers, brazen bullies, and scheming frenemies. It always makes me laugh whenever I see the trope where they threaten to humiliate the person in bondage by spreading embarrassing pictures of them bound and gagged around on social media or to friends. They think that they can blackmail the person into being their slave, doing what they want, or giving them favors. This will not go the way that they think it will go. The person that is bound and gagged will come out looking rosy compared to them. Think about it in real life. There are pictures of me bound and gagged that exist in the world. I hope they don't spread to my social circle. There are also pictures that exist of women that I've bound and gagged. I pray to almighty Christ that those never get out. That would be much much worse. If my friends and family saw pictures of me tied up...they'd think: "Oh, that Fandango, what a cheeky, kinky little scamp he is. Oh how embarrassing for him." If my friends and family saw pictures of women that I had tied up, that I had posted on my social media, they'd think: "Holy Shit. Is Fandango a serial killer? These are creepy. Why would he think that he can post these?" And I don't think that's just because I'm a guy. I think that anybody posting embarrassing pics of a restrained captive without their permission will face the revulsion of all of their friends and family. I think it will backfire on them SPECTACULARLY. I have a story I'm working on right now (it won't post for quite a while) in which a girl has photos that she took of a male friend bound and gagged on her bed get out and start leaking to mutual friends. Part of the story is her DESPERATELY trying to stop the leak from spreading because of what people will think about her (the dominant one) and how it will affect her relationship with the guy, who would rightly feel betrayed. This trope always assumes that it's only embarrassing to be the submissive. That isn't my experience.

• Kinky romantic games between partners or potential partners where the dominant member leaves the other one alone while they go to a party or the spa or drinks with their girlfriends/bros. I actually somewhat enjoy reading this trope. But it turns the scene from a romance to a comedy for me. I understand that there are probably a lot of people who might find that kind of neglect and degradation to be sexy. I'm just not one of them. If I'm submitting to be tied up...I want you to have fun with me. If I tie a girl up, I promise you...I have ABSOLUTELY nothing better to do. I don't want to go to a party. I don't want to go for drinks. I want to enjoy the girl who let me tie her up. It's not even about leaving captives alone, which we all know is unsafe. It's just about the message that it sends. One of my favorite scenes of this is in the show Billions. I don't watch the show Billions but my brother does and when I see somebody bound and gagged on TV I usually stop and pay attention. Paul Giamatti's character is bound and gagged by his wife and is being tormented with a cattle prod. He's into it. His gorgeous wife is played by Maggie Siff and she has to take a call from her boss for some reason. I didn't see the full episode. The context of the call was lost on me. But it's an upsetting call and she's gone for a while. When she finally returns, he's freed himself and is eating ice cream while watching TV. He says that they can try again some time when she's in the mood. And I thought..."good for him". I understand that this trope is fun. But I love the idea of submissives giving it back to their dommes when a line of respect is breached.

There are also dozens of tropes that I love and wish I saw more of on this site. But this post is already long enough.

[blackbound]

[mention]Fandango[/mention], that was a great post and I really want to hear about the tropes you want to see more, if you are so inclined.

[Fandango]

[mention]Fandango[/mention], that was a great post and I really want to hear about the tropes you want to see more, if you are so inclined.

Sure. I’m always willing to extrapolate and provide examples. I just saw that my last post was getting particularly long and didn’t want to clog the board. But since you asked, I’ll be happy to continue.

And because it’s you, [mention] blackbound [/mention], I wanted to follow up on my last post. You wrote a story called “Jingle” that I read a couple weeks ago that falls into the category of the second trope I described. Please know that this was not a knock on you and that I think you’re a phenomenal writer and enjoyed that story. I appreciate all tropes and think that they can work. That was just an example of one that I wish was played differently more often. When I read your story I did think that Daniel was damaging his own reputation as much as the main character’s. The administration is surely going to wonder why all the male athletes at that college are washing themselves at the water fountain in the hallway. Because they’re terrified to go in the locker room for fear of a menace and his two goons. But I think that you’re one of the elite writers on this board and I would never intentionally besmirch another author. Especially one as talented as yourself.

That being said, I do want to shout out authors and give credit where credit is due. So I’m going to list nine tropes that I LOVE and think are woefully underutilized. And I’m going to shout out some authors who I think do them very well. I’m not going to use the mention feature, as I’m not looking to summon them to this post. But I want to highlight some excellent uses of the trope by a variety of authors.

Here are nine underutilized, fantastic tropes that I wish to see more of:

• Bondage is often about a power exchange between two people. But I love when one person is thoroughly bound and gagged but no power has been exchanged. I call it “dommeing from the bottom”. The captive is ostensibly at their captor’s mercy but it’s still the captor who is scared of the captive. A prime example of this is WillHBonney’s story “Madison Gets a Taste of Her Own Medicine”. Madison was the narrator’s girlfriend’s older sister. She’d trussed, tormented, and humiliated the narrator in multiple previous stories. This was the story where he was finally getting his revenge. And yet he spent the first half of the story still terrified of her and her reprisal. He eventually did start to enjoy his revenge but his girlfriend had to really steer him into it. Madison still lived rent free in his head as a malicious, terrifying force even once she was tightly restrained. I look to this tale sometimes for ways to harness a fearsome aura for a captive who I still want to be imposing.

• I care a lot more about why somebody is tied up than how they are tied up. And I love when the captor has a motive that goes beyond sheer enjoyment of controlling or binding somebody or anything strictly monetary. Most stories on this site feature a captor binding a victim because they enjoy it. Sometimes a robbery or money grab is attached. But I love stories where there is another motive and the bondage is just a means to an end. They have to keep the captive out of the way for some other reason. A recent example of this is the fun story “For Science!” by DuckStewStories. The antagonist keeps her rival and roommate restrained to win a science fair. Taping her up serves the dual purpose of hampering her competition and demonstrating her project. Another example is “Winning at All Costs” by Driverman.

• Turnabout. I love when captives and captors switch roles. I love to see the power exchange in a relationship seesaw. I understand that some people are entirely into domination and some are entirely into submission, but I love to see a relationship of nuanced characters from both angles. Some great examples of this are Chris and Hayley by DuctTapeSilence. Normally, it’s Hayley taping Chris up but Chris does have an arc where he gets his revenge. TiedAndTaped3D also has a series featuring Kelsey and a narrator who each restrain each other. And there was a series of stories, only some of which were recovered and archived, by an author named Sketchy. These featured two characters named Sarah and T who both got the better of each other on different occasions.

• Games. I love when captives are forced to play games. And I love when bondage is incorporated into larger games shifting the focus of the bondage. I love when captives aren’t solely focused on trying to escape but rather have some sort of larger game at play. There are several great examples of this. “Samantha’s DnD Tie Up Game” by puddy300 is a great one. “Among Us” by Mineira1986 is another stellar one. “Scenes from a Sushi Place” by lanadelgagged was one that was headed in this direction and that I hope she (or he) continues. Tom Yi also had a story called “Babysitter Night” in which the game Love Letter determined who got tied up. Not quite the same thing, but enjoyable none the less. I love board games and I love competition. Mixing them with bondage just makes sense to me.

• I thoroughly enjoy stories where a character is reticent to engage in public bondage for the purposes of embarrassment or humiliation but are non-forcefully coerced into it by another character. I don’t want them to be jumped or drugged. I want them to be anxious about it but agree to it because they care about another person who is more exhilarated by the prospect of them being bound and displayed for an audience. Two great examples of this are “On Artistic Display for an A” by Kas and “A Conventional Experience” by bfe8.

• Aftercare. I enjoy it. I can’t get enough of it. It’s so underrepresented here given how important it is with actual bondage. There are thousands of stories on this site and yet “aftercare” only gets 37 hits when searching. To be fair, a lot of people might use two words. But I rarely see it. I remember a true story called “Almost Caught! Rescued at the Last Minute” by RopedbyWife where he goes into an aftercare routine and I remember thinking that I wanted to see more of it. It felt fresh to show characters going through their routine. I just like when captors show some regard for their captive once everything is done. Not a proper example, but I remember a story called “Careful What You Wish For” by guardian741. Two females tie and torment their male co-worker. When they’re done they take him to dinner and give him $50 as a “no hard feelings gift”. I remember thinking that his forgiveness came pretty cheap but I was at least glad that there was some smoothing over effort shown.

• Discovering an already bound captive. Most stories on this board focus on either the captive or the captor. They like to show the actual tying. That’s great. But I also like stories where the POV character is neither. They’re a third party just experiencing bondage from an outside perspective. The first chapter of “Bondage Model by Choice” by Slackywacky comes to mind. Linda will go on to have plenty of experiences being tied up. But in the opening chapter she’s just a UPS driver who discovers a woman bound and gagged. I like the mysterious nature of this angle as the person tries to figure out the situation and process it without full context.

• Guilt. I love when the person doing the tying expresses some level of guilt or self doubt over their treatment of their captive. Rtj65 does this well in both “A Grey Area” and “Causality”. It’s also done in a much more dramatic and disassociated way in “The Binding of Dan & Kate” by Theo73. If there is one trope that I’m going to get accused of overusing in my stories it’s the fact that I like to create opportunities for my protagonist to tie and torment people without guilt. This will usually involve him or her being mistreated, wronged, or humiliated in some way early in the story so that the reader is willing to side with my protagonist when they take down their nemesis. I like their actions to be guilt free because mine so rarely are. Guilt is a major part of the bondage experience for me. Even though every experience I’ve ever had has been fully consensual and discussed beforehand…it’s just something that’s there. And I kind of like to see it represented in stories on this board.

• Miscommunication with potential rescuer due to being gagged. I like it when the person who is restrained is discovered by somebody that they think can help them only to be left restrained because the person wrongfully assumed that they were enjoying themselves or needed to stay tied for some reason. This is caused by the captive not being able to communicate their need for freedom because of the gag. Don’t confuse this with the potential rescuer not untying them because they're enjoying their plight and struggle. I like that less. I prefer when it’s just a general misunderstanding.

So those are some tropes that I love. If anybody wants to point me in the direction of some stories that feature things along any of those lines…I’d love to hear about them. I’m always looking for new stories to read.

[blackbound]

[mention]Fandango[/mention], thank you for your incredibly detailed response. I certainly recognized myself in trope 2, and I definitely don't take it personally, especially not after your effusive and kind feedback. But - not to defend myself, just because I think it's interesting - let me pull back the curtain about this story some.

The initial idea came from a short video on Twitter, showing a sub with jingly bells clipped to his nipples. From there, I developed the idea of the harmonica, and how it would invert the "stay silent to not be discovered" trope by actively forcing the protagonist to not make noise instead of just passively staying quiet, then forcing him to reveal himself anyway for fear of being stuck in the locker with no easy way of communicating the lock code.

The obvious setting, of course, was a hazing. But, if you look at the story again, the very first line is "In retrospect, I should've just let them haze me along with everyone else."

My thought there was that there was going to be a relatively straighforward hazing for all the newbies, which is of course in and of itself a trope. Had the protagonist just showed up for that instead of avoiding it, the story wouldn't have happened. But he didn't, and we can assume that in the spirit of "the many shall suffer for the sins of the one", this had sone unspecific consequences for the other students being hazed - which explains why they show so little mercy to Jingle in the end. And Daniel, of course, had to set an example so this wouldn't happen again. The other students have nothing to fear from him. And if I can come up with a scenario, there's definitely a possibility for Daniel to get his comeuppance, like the insane bullies from A Night to Remember got in the follow-up, Karma.

Ok, it's beginning to sound like I'm tooting my own horn way too much. I've used some of the tropes you like in modified forms, and some are upcoming in my current story, but the list is very interesting food for thought.

[BlissfulMisery]

Aftercare. I enjoy it. I can’t get enough of it. It’s so underrepresented here given how important it is with actual bondage. There are thousands of stories on this site and yet “aftercare” only gets 37 hits when searching. To be fair, a lot of people might use two words. But I rarely see it. I remember a true story called “Almost Caught! Rescued at the Last Minute” by RopedbyWife where he goes into an aftercare routine and I remember thinking that I wanted to see more of it. It felt fresh to show characters going through their routine. I just like when captors show some regard for their captive once everything is done. Not a proper example, but I remember a story called “Careful What You Wish For” by guardian741. Two females tie and torment their male co-worker. When they’re done they take him to dinner and give him $50 as a “no hard feelings gift”. I remember thinking that his forgiveness came pretty cheap but I was at least glad that there was some smoothing over effort shown.

Honestly have to echo that it shocks me how rare this is in stories. It is something I consider pretty important when I write anything of this sort and would only choose to leave it out if there was a specific reason.

I guess the obvious reason why it is usually skipped is at a glance it does not seem 'exciting enough', but I would argue it is a great place to have character interaction/have a touching moment to unwind from the previous intensity. Similar to how it works in real life*, in a story it can provide a sort of catharsis afterwards.

*Obviously I am not trying to claim it is exactly the same thing, stories are fundamentally more detached then reality no matter how immersive they are.

Especially important if the scene described was particularly intense. One does not come out of strict/long term bondage, with possibly other things that happened alongside as if nothing at all happened physically or emotionally, and I think showing that is a positive, not a negative, and gives a more complete experience.

And if writing partially or fully from the point of view of the dominant or top, well, I would say it is even more important. Obviously depends on the specific character one is writing, but I have a hard time imagining none of them would feel any residual guilt for example* (as was also mentioned in the quoted post), as that is a pretty common thing (yes, dominants/tops can require aftercare too, even if it often looks different!). And in general showing that they actually care about the submissive or bottom, despite whatever they might have done during the actual tie-up is a good thing, especially if the story lacked explicit consent (another common peeve, but I do understand that stories are not usually meant to be realistic).

*And it is not strange for a sub/bottom to feel some guilt over it too! Bondage is an intense emotional, not just physical experience, and I feel like sometimes that is unintentionally downplayed in fiction.

Obviously none of this applies in a non-consensual scenario, but that is well... obvious.

Well, I could go on more, but I think I will cut this 'short'.

[Alisonlovesropes]

For me tie ups are supposed to be fun. I don’t mind people being tied up,for excessively long periods or even left alone whilst partner goes out. It’s dangerous but this is fantasy.

What I don’t like is anyone being at real,risk,of dying (execution, mafia killing etc). Or any non-consensual,bandage, which includes kidnappings and home invasion unless it is a game setting.

[lanadelgagged]

[mention]Fandango[/mention] Your response was very insightful and detailed. Thank you for taking the time to craft it, and what an honour it is to have one of my stories mentioned as a trope you enjoy. <3

[AlexUSA3]

[mention]Fandango[/mention] can't say I didn't see myself in both the tropes and cliches that you mentioned in your lists. I suppose we all have our pros and our cons.

Yes, I enjoy the concept of "bondage of necessity" and "captor still scared of captive" albeit the story in which I am currently using these concepts are in a mixed setting that isn't necessarily enjoyable to all readers.

I have never even heard of the term "aftercare" and thus wouldn't have ever called it such myself even when possibly describing such elements in a story.

[AlexUSA3]

Now, a big time cliche I am going to mention because it features in many stories I have seen across the years, and that is having women just instantly get horny in bondage. It's a concept I actually attack quite viciously in my stories because life isn't this way in any sense.

You know the kind of scenario I mean: woman gets kidnapped, captor stuffs a dildo in her, captive instantly starts writhing like a p0rn star or at least eventually starts acting like it. The setting is irrelevant; the woman is going to be pissed off. It is going to be weeks, months, or years, depending on the level of offense, before that woman will sing "Auld Lang Syne" with you, if ever. If she's been really violated, she is going to see bondage and those who like it as repulsive creatures.

The other thing never discussed in general, similar to the above, is the side effects of the experience. I believe [mention]Mineira1986[/mention] captured this in Among Us and with her help I have captured it in The Rookie. Male or female, even in a non-sexual context, non-consensual bondage can be psychologically traumatic. There's a big difference between a surprise TUG with your college roommate who knows your boundaries and won't violate them and being forced into a de facto "do or die" situation. Believe me, Mineira's Wendy and my Courtney will need months, if not years, of psychiatric treatment and TLC from their loved ones to be able to live a normal life, and at the end of Among Us you feel mentally exhausted just like Wendy.

The third trope I see a lot is the concept of what I will call "liquid time." Many stories seem to lose their grip on time and the duration of events. Now, in my earlier Cool Girls' Club tales I frequently violated this one, but after about 30 chapters I realized "Hey, these girls have homework to do and exams to study for." In a realistic setting like CGC, such things must be properly tabulated in order for everything to feel properly resolved or somewhere back in my mind I will know something doesn't fly.

A beautiful use of "liquid time" is seen in [mention]Shotrow[/mention]'s Riders of the Midnight Sun as he places the world inside this strange vacuum in which time can be distorted, and the effects are very obvious while also conveying a much deeper message. I am sorry I have not kept myself up to date on this one as he has done a very good job of covering his bases in this world.

Another fantastic mention is deserved for those stories that reveal something amazing: watching people (real or fictional) change with time. Whether it's the triumph of a job well done or the horror of a personal loss, it's great reading tales like [mention]DuckStewStories[/mention] or [mention]calebtras[/mention] and seeing how TUGs and friendship can be an escape from the horrors of life (I have to toot my own "CGC" horn on this one as well).

And, I guess, that's why I write the stories that I write. I read other's stories, saw what, in my opinion, were their pros and cons, and decided to write stories by using the pros and fixing the cons. This is not true for everyone though, and the concepts I see as pros and cons another person may see as cons and pros.

While I don't get too much time to read stories, there is never a shortage of great tales for me to enjoy.

[banshee]

Love to see the responses this has inspired

[sami200456boyfriend]

The damsel in distress one. Geez can't the guys get it more often.

[Fandango]

Love to see the responses this has inspired

This thread really has seem to have struck a chord, banshee.

how it would invert the "stay silent to not be discovered" trope by actively forcing the protagonist to not make noise instead of just passively staying quiet, then forcing him to reveal himself anyway for fear of being stuck in the locker with no easy way of communicating the lock code.


And Daniel, of course, had to set an example so this wouldn't happen again. The other students have nothing to fear from him.

While I do love tropes, I especially love an inverted or creatively skewed version of a trope. And you're quite good in that respect. "Stay Silent to Not be Discovered" is definitely one I'll be playing with in one of my stories in the future.

Also, I do love that you've had your characters think through their actions. My gripe is certainly more with characters who I think are overlooking what the perceptions of their actions will be by third parties. As long as the character knows who they are and what they're about, I'm all for it.

I guess the obvious reason why it is usually skipped is at a glance it does not seem 'exciting enough', but I would argue it is a great place to have character interaction/have a touching moment to unwind from the previous intensity. Similar to how it works in real life*, in a story it can provide a sort of catharsis afterwards.

I agree 100%. And I absolutely understand why it's not in a lot of stories. I don't need it in EVERY story. It's not appropriate to the context of every story. I'd just like to see it more often. I'd like to see specifically what aftercare looks like to other people. I like this board because it gives me insight into how people view these things differently than I might. I find aftercare very exciting and only really know what it looks like in my experience. I want to know how it works in other relationships and I just don't stumble upon it often enough. And if I do, it's usually just a sentence or two.

[mention]Fandango[/mention] Your response was very insightful and detailed. Thank you for taking the time to craft it, and what an honour it is to have one of my stories mentioned as a trope you enjoy. <3

Of course. You're a pro at pulling the reader in with an enticing hook. I only mentioned one, but I enjoy the vast majority of your stories.

The other thing never discussed in general, similar to the above, is the side effects of the experience...non-consensual bondage can be psychologically traumatic.

The third trope I see a lot is the concept of what I will call "liquid time." Many stories seem to lose their grip on time and the duration of events.

I understand why people don't go into the negative side effects of trauma more often. For a lot of people I think that they want to read about a fun fantasy and the reality of that fantasy is a lot less fun. It might not be honest storytelling but it's often more entertaining. I can easily re-watch movies like Indiana Jones or Tomb Raider or Back to the Future or Atomic Blonde where characters just shrug off trauma by the next chapter like it's no big deal. Whereas, movies like Requiem for a Dream or A Simple Plan were great movies that I'm only ever going to watch once. I just wrote a chapter of a story where the main character has a panic attack while tied up and things like night terrors and agoraphobia manifest themselves for that character later down the line. It's something I wanted to explore. But it certainly isn't fun to write. So while I absolutely concur with you for realism's sake...this is one that I understand why authors lean into the fantasy. There is an allure to characters like Indiana Jones, Lara Croft, and James Bond who can face certain death one minute and bounce back the next.

"Liquid Time" is a good one and something that I certainly struggle with. It's something that I actively try to account for and it sometimes just has a way of slipping away from you. Solid examples.

[Arkane]

I don't like the easy depiction of female pleasure in stories (even less in bondage videos). A vibrator is all the female needs to lose control and orgasm, even when she's tightly tied.

As far as I know, it's not so simple. I've read the opinion by Kristine Imboch (a.k.a Lorelei, from Harmony fame) stating that she would need easy breathing actually to have an orgasm in bondage. So, no gags, for example. And I doubt excruciating bondage can lead to orgasm.

[RopedByWife]

"I remember a true story called “Almost Caught! Rescued at the Last Minute” by RopedbyWife where he goes into an aftercare routine and I remember thinking that I wanted to see more of it. It felt fresh to show characters going through their routine."

[mention]Fandango[/mention] , great post and thanks for mentioning me! I always like writing about not only the narrow confines of the specific tie up game, but what happened before and after. Did we discuss the upcoming evening's capture walking home after dinner downtown? What happened after I was set free? Was a given a bath or wrapped up in a blanket to nap on the floor in front of the fireplace? How did I prepare myself for playtime, what things did she get ready? What's the importance of having coils of rope stacked on the bed forming a perfect pyramid? Do those details matter? Is the set up important? I think so, because it gives weight and adds to the overall adventure! I always wondered if people liked those parts or skimmed past them to jump ahead to the more risque parts.

[Fandango]

I always wondered if people liked those parts or skimmed past them to jump ahead to the more risque parts.

I only get to speak for one person. There are probably a good number of people who do both. Some people just want to get to the tie up action. But I fall firmly into the camp of wanting to learn more about the people involved. The context of the relationship is very important to me. Two people doing something in one setting will receive a very different reaction from me than two other people doing the EXACT SAME THING in a different contextualized relationship. I get less concerned with your stories because we openly know that you're enjoying yourself. And we're certainly left with the assumption that your wife is enjoying herself. But there are definitely stories where that line is not always drawn as clearly and the reader is left to interpret. Which is fine. But having one person torment and degrade another person during a bondage session and then share a nice friendly chat and a plate of strawberry shortcake with them afterwards pulls back the curtain in a way that I find to be pleasant and entertaining. It was a fun twist and it's always nice to see how a relationship dynamic adjusts itself once both parties are out of the ropes to highlight how the ropes augment the relationship.

[Straitjacketed]

I think there's a tendency to regard tropes and clichés as negative, at least faintly, and that isn't necessarily the case.

I'm responding to [mention]Fandango[/mention]'s first post, hopefully not defensively but because it's made me think about the stance I take when I write bondage fiction and also what I like to read. It seems to me that the three points made could be grouped, broadly, under the theme of realism. I read them as a sort of plea for bondage fiction to be more realistic in terms of explaining the effect of the scene on those involved, etc, etc.

The point about the bound character being left not knowing how long they'd been bound... I can see why that might be viewed as "lazy" but, in my own case, I often end stories there because it seems the natural place to end the narrative. This is, I guess, because the majority of my tales involve unwilling/non-consensual tying up so there isn't going to be an untying and post-scene "how was that for you" discussion.

Perhaps if one reuses the same characters in an ongoing serial it's different but, in a one-shot (and, generally speaking, that's what I tend to write), I really don't care what happens to the protagonist. I'm quite happy to end in an unresolved manner. I'm the same with watching films: I don't need to know whether Scarlett O'Hara actually *does* get Rhett Butler back, or even how she feels the next day.

In fact (and I know this might seem meta), I get a little irritated by the inevitable comments, after the conclusion of a story, asking "what happened next?" or saying "great start, look forward to seeing X get their own back" or whatever. There have been times when I, as a writer, have continued stories longer than I should've done because of a general interest in knowing what happened next.

I tend to vary. As a general rule, I find stories rooted in realism sexier but I do bear in mind that, at the end of the day, what I personally am writing, is motivated by a need to get my ideas down on the page and to *turn myself on*. If that basic objective is met, I'm not too bothered about trying to perfect plot, characterisation and so on.

[Fandango]

I think there's a tendency to regard tropes and clichés as negative, at least faintly, and that isn't necessarily the case.

I'm responding to [mention]Fandango[/mention]'s first post, hopefully not defensively but because it's made me think about the stance I take when I write bondage fiction and also what I like to read.

The point about the bound character being left not knowing how long they'd been bound... I can see why that might be viewed as "lazy" but, in my own case, I often end stories there because it seems the natural place to end the narrative. This is, I guess, because the majority of my tales involve unwilling/non-consensual tying up so there isn't going to be an untying and post-scene "how was that for you" discussion.

You're more than justified in defending yourself. I think I may regret using the word "lazy". That is how I think about it in certain cases because I think that having the story fade to black with the protagonist still in bondage sometimes occurred because the author didn't know how to wrap up the story in another way. Or couldn't properly contextualize what a release would look like. That certainly isn't always the case. And the it's not necessarily even often the case. I might have generalized with a little bit of a broader stroke than I intended to. I was just referring to things that take ME out of a story or a sour a story for ME. I do like to make sure that a story's protagonist is alright. But that's a personal preference and I understand that authors will have their own motives and preferences and that doesn't make the story any less valid. It just makes it less enjoyable to my taste, which doesn't need to be (and shouldn't be) the concern of the author. I do apologize if anything in my original response seemed like a slight or attack against you or any other author. That's never my intention. I was simply trying to answer what I don't enjoy about certain stories. I didn't mean to imply that those stories were in any way "lesser" or that they lack value because I dislike a trope.

[Lucky Lottie]

I won't say it's a trope exactly but the lack of "devil details" as I call them can pull me out of a story a little if they gloss over them too much. I get that focusing on the fun of bondage probably why we're all here but it would be nice to read a relatable section of a bondage scene that really gets to the Nitty gritty.

I've lost count of the number of times I've had hair caught in my eyes and mouth during a session because my bangs were a little too short to stick in my ponytail but too long to stay out of my face. Even during a relatively friendly session I've completely lost track of time trying to shake the hair out of the corner of my mouth.

Then there's the not so perfect ropes that are just in the worst place. Being hogtied can be uncomfortable and then the knot between your ankles ride up and press into your bone for what feels like hours, so much so o forget the pain of being tied up altogether. Getting untied means nothing to the feeling of having that little pain in the butt getting moved leaving a suitable bruise to remember for a week.

Again I see why people don't write them in (I would probably forget too) but they come back to me when I read some stories.

Just my two cents.